Summer finishing, probably, and finishing in DxO

[Mike_Murphy_1948 (Michael Murphy)]

3 Treatments of the same frame, which is likely the last swallow this summer. Although the weather is forecast to hold for this week, the birds are swirling higher and higher, and in larger numbers. Back to the shot: it was still quite early this morning, so light in short supply. I don’t like setting the shutter speed longer than 1/2500, and one would like the DoF to give a sharp image over the whole subject, so f7.1 and fingers crossed here.

Here is the original frame:
D6700092.ARW (33.3 MB)
Too much empty space, so I cropped on the same aspect ratio, using Deep Prime for Noise Reduction, and a little sharpening (motion blur 20, noise reduction 1) in Topaz Photo AI.

An alternative sharpening in Nik 6 Output sharpening (someone on another forum saw some artefacts in a previous upscaled Topaz AI treatment)

Now maybe someone can see a difference? For balance, here is a treatment in Luminar Neo - I bought a collection of templates for birds, but was annoyed not to find one for swallows.

Which, if any, do people like, and why?

[Wolfgang ([ Win10, PL+VP+FP, Nik7 / 3.3 ])]

I would actually leave it out as it lacks sharpness at 100%.

• That said, for online purposes and if you don’t enlarge it any further, it’s fine.
• In terms of spiciness, I prefer the second one.
• The third shows a different contrast and kind of enhanced color, but has a large halo around.

( note – I’m no “birder” )

[Mike_Murphy_1948 (Michael Murphy)]

Thanks, Wolfgang! I prefer to shoot at 1/4000, but there wasn’t much light when I went outside this morning, and you have to be there at the same time as the birds.

[mikemyers]

I like the first one more than the second, because the sky seems more uniform.

The third one looks like what @Wolfgang wrote - I don’t like that effect.

As to the bird, I can’t see what is different between the first two images - only the sky looks different.

Since the bird seems to be flying from right to left, would a horizontal crop work better?

[mikemyers]

My version:

D6700092.ARW (33.3 MB)
D6700092.ARW.dop (13.1 KB)

[Mike_Murphy_1948 (Michael Murphy)]

Thanks Mike!
To address the cropping first, I can’t argue a case for or against the orientation. Unless (and this is gut arithmetic) I get more bird in the vertical version for the same dimension of print. Until I get the hard copy print of the last swallow, I shan’t be able to evaluate the charge of upscaling generated artefacts. And even then I am beginning to mistrust my eyes. Perhaps I shall need new glasses next year.
Which takes me on to the sharpening. I looked at both versions at 200% and couldn’t see much of a difference… I would get a better (to my eyes) version of the wingtips from using Topaz’ latest Lens_BlurV2, but I think the head is sharper using Topaz’ Motion Blur. Of course, the problem is I can’t mix and match the methods. And at my shooting distance (exiftool says 38 metres) I should have 54cm of sharpness either side of the subject.
What do you think? (These screen grabs are 200%)

Above: Lens blur v2 on the head

Above: Lens blur v2 on the (bird’s) left wing

Lens Blur v2 on right wingtip

Motion blur on head

Left side is the before (ie, taken from DXO), right image is Photo AI’s sharpening

[Joanna (Joanna Carter)]

Were you aware that Topaz Photo AI can add more than one sharpening layer, each selectively masked using different modes?

[swmurray]

The original is slightly out-of-focus, but appears more focus than motion blur to my eyes. Did you try some of the other sharpening mode such as “refocus” or “standard”? Perhaps choosing a different algorithm would work better. I can’t really confirm due to online image quality.

Are you by chance using any image stabilization? This can hurt at higher shutter speeds.

Here’s TP default denoise with sharpening - std at 67%

[Mike_Murphy_1948 (Michael Murphy)]

Were you aware that Topaz Photo AI can add more than one sharpening layer, each selectively masked using different modes?

I wasn’t! Thanks v much, Joanna!

[Mike_Murphy_1948 (Michael Murphy)]

The original is slightly out-of-focus, but appears more focus than motion blur to my eyes. Did you try some of the other sharpening mode such as “refocus” or “standard”? Perhaps choosing a different algorithm would work better. I can’t really confirm due to online image quality.

Are you by chance using any image stabilization? This can hurt at higher shutter speeds.

Blockquote

I was using the lens’s stabilisation. If this guy turns up tomorrow (though I fear he is gone for his winter break), I’ll try without.

I am surprised that you think the image is out-of-focus. A7info shows the focus is on the bird’s left wingtip - well, maybe a couple of cm inboard. And this is shot number 5 in a burst, so the famous Sony AF should have caught up by now, And A7 does show the tracking sensors centred over the centre of the AF point. I do hope we are not going to retreat to the bad old days of having to make adjustments for front- and back-focus.

Still, if (as the forecast promises) it is rainy tomorrow, or if the birds have flown, then I’ll give Photo AI’s refocus a whirl using Joanna’s suggestion of layered adjustments.

Damn! Forgot to upload the proof from A7info

[Mike_Murphy_1948 (Michael Murphy)]

Putting together some of what has been said so far, here we are two frames later. I dialled the noise reduction down to Deep Prime, changed the crop to square to reduce the size of the vacant lot, and flipped horizontally to indulge the Western tendency to start scanning on the left. All this in PL. Then, in PhotoAI, added three sharpening layers:

• Natural for the head
• Motion Blur for the leading edges and head
• Strong for the trailing edge and aft

[mikemyers]

If you wanted to indulge the Western tendency to start scanning on the left, perhaps the head should be at the left, so we “westerners” see the head before we see the tail. Of course, all of this is silly, but on my screen, to me, the bird seems to be flying away, out of my screen, rather than into it. Not sure how I feel about “flipping” an image that way. I can tell you how I “feel”, but that’s meaningless information. The image ought to be the way YOU saw it. I do like that with this image, I can see more of the bird’s head. You could “cheat” a little and make the bird a little lighter, so we can better see the color of the bird? …ignore all this if you want. I’m far from any kind of expert…

[swmurray]

Not critiquing the photo - it’s good. The photo sharpness does not look like “motion blur” from a slow shutter speed. Also agree that A7info shows a good focus point. That’s when I suggest a look at other Topaz sharpness alogrithms and perhaps different reasons for the softness, such as the OSS mode.

When learning about my 200-600 several internet bird photographers suggested turning off IS (OSS) when capturing BIF and other fast shutter speeds as the OSS system doesn’t respond that fast. My images generally seem sharper when using mode 3 or off rather than mode 1 for these type photos. I also find that Topaz’s standard sharpness algorithm works better in these instances.

Just a thought to consider. Your result may be different.

Some references…

Manual for Sony SEL200600G lens

Mark Galer’s explanation of the modes

[mikemyers]

@Mike_Murphy_1948

This image reminds me of the images I used to post here, about which Joanna and others pointed out that the image is not large enough on the sensor, telling me I needed a longer lens, or to get closer. If you post the original image here, that will immediately show us how much of the frame is being occupied by the bird.

Also, what shutter speed are you using? That was something else I needed to correct.
Can you please post the full image?

[swmurray]

@mikemyers: @Mike_Murphy_1948 posted the original image, SS, and f-stop in the initial post

[mikemyers]

Now I’m confused - in the original image, the eye was barely visible. In the above image, the eye is photographed more from the side.

[quote=“swmurray, post:8, topic:39107”]

Compare the eye in that image with this latest image:

@Mike_Murphy_1948

D6700094_DxO1920×1920 44.6 KB

Now I’m confused even more, but this new image is more from the “side” than from “below”.

???

[Mike_Murphy_1948 (Michael Murphy)]

Don’t worry Mike, I take no offence. I shall look at lightening the bird (I am a bit vague on colour theory, found the LAB plugin in Aftershot Plus easier than fiddling with the HSL wheel in PL).

On the Sony bodies you can tell the metering to use the focus point as the argument for exposure calculation (here, to choose the ISO speed), but I have set a limit of ISO 8000 (I think, or maybe 6400 when I took this frame). And the focus point has to be dead on the right bit of the bird’s plumage, With such a contrasty target, it’s anybody’s guess whether one will get the result or not!

Cheers
MM

[Mike_Murphy_1948 (Michael Murphy)]

@mikemyers

This image reminds me of the images I used to post here, about which Joanna and others pointed out that the image is not large enough on the sensor, telling me I needed a longer lens, or to get closer. If you post the original image here, that will immediately show us how much of the frame is being occupied by the bird.

Also, what shutter speed are you using? That was something else I needed to correct.
Can you please post the full image?

Here is the original frame, only exposure increased by 2.5 stops and Deep Prime (otherwise you might think I had sent you the Black Screen of Death)

1/2500 because I was trying to keep the ISO low. The camera chose 800.

And Joanna would be right about the lens, if I could afford to get a teleconverter for the lens. Maybe next year… For the time being you have to shoot the glass you have in your bag.

Now I’m confused even more, but this new image is more from the “side” than from “below”.

???

Two different frames from the same burst. The bird was climbing - more so in the second (there was an empty frame between them as I tried to keep up!)

Cheers

[Mike_Murphy_1948 (Michael Murphy)]

@swmurray

When learning about my 200-600 several internet bird photographers suggested turning off IS (OSS) when capturing BIF and other fast shutter speeds as the OSS system doesn’t respond that fast. My images generally seem sharper when using mode 3 or off rather than mode 1 for these type photos. I also find that Topaz’s standard sharpness algorithm works better in these instances.

Just a thought to consider. Your result may be different.

Thanks! Will try if I see another bird this year (it’s uncertain whether they have gone).

[mikemyers]

Short answer,

Now that I see the full image, I suspect that @Joanna will confirm that it is too small I the frame to get a good image. @Wolfgang has told me the same thing. I got my advice from them, and others.

Also, if I were you, I would try to focus on the middle of the bird, not the wingtip. I think either way you will get similar results, but the middle of the bird is likely to be better, because of the tiny size of the bird on your sensor.

My opinion, not fact, 1/2500th shutter should be good to minimize camera movement.

Next opinion, ISO 800 should be fine, but on my Nikons, I would go much higher.

As to exposure, again, if I were you, I would adjust the exposure to lighten the bird somewhat. Just try +1 for the exposure and see how that changes your results.

Other than how to spell the name, I know nothing about Sony cameras - there are others here who know and understand them much better.

Or, ask @Joanna to look at the full image, and ask her advice on any changes you can try. Even if this bird has gone on vacation, there must be other birds you can practice with?

@Mike_Murphy_1948

On the Sony bodies you can tell the metering to use the focus point as the argument for exposure calculation

Try the same everything next time, but try +1 on the exposure, to over-expose the bird slightly. It is very dark on your image (in my opinion), as shown below: