PLv7: Color Accentuation (Saturation & Vibrancy) merged into the HSL tool ... Good or Bad?

[JoPoV]

@BHAYT

Plus since I have now decided that the ‘Color Accentuation’ with Sat=100 may not be the same as “Master” channel at 100% we have an issue with “Master” becoming a replacement for CA!

Since there is now one control less for global saturation (only the one in the HSL menu remains in v7), what happens when opening images done in previous version and which have custom saturation settings applied both in HSL menu and in color accentuation tab ?
Does backward compatibility works here ?
Or does those images look no more like what they should ?

[Guenterm (Win11, MAC OS, DPL 5, FP, VP, Nik4, Olympus)]

Hi, thanks for all the testing information which still prevents me from testing version 7 at all, not even on a virtual HyperV W11 system.

But it also shows that we are still comparing apples and oranges if we don’t get into the habit of specifying the technical data of the systems on which we test.
And this includes not only the technical data such as CPU, graphics card, graphics driver version, virtual or bare, etc., but also the operating system version, patch level, version of the software with major and minor details, etc.

This would probably avoid some confusion.

Happy testing

Guenter

[BHAYT (Bryan [WIN10, PL8, VP4, FP7, G9 & EM1 Mkii, RTX 3060])]

@JoPoV My first test with PL7.0.0 was to test that situation, CA to HSL “Master” (White) but I didn’t even vaguely understand HSL so that test was to ensure that the CA values made it to HSL which they did!

But we now have a situation of CA setting + HSL “Master” setting on a PL6 edit transitioning to 7 plus what detectable image changes may result, if any.

However, I developed those Partial Presets on PL6 so that you can go and use them to conduct your own tests on PL6 HSL which is little changed on PL7 except for the demise of CA on PL7.

So using those presets you can set up the scenarios for

1. CA versus HSL
   1 CA
   2 HSL
   3 Compare CA to HSL
2. CA + HSL (versus the results from 1.1 and 1.2)
3. HSL “Master” only
4. HSL Colour Channels only
5. HSL “Master” + Colour Channels

on you own images and come to your own conclusions.

@Guenterm what about my weight, height and inside leg measurement as well.

Sorry, you are correct but I don’t actually have all those details to hand but I think that DxO is logging that away somewhere so I need to look!

However, aren’t you “lucky” that some of us have taken the plunge and are actually trying PL7 released versions, so far 7.0.0 and 7.0.1 to give you a better insight.

[Joanna (Joanna Carter)]

@BHAYT

the reset is not selective

The reset button is for the entire colour wheel. To reset a single channel, just double-click on that dot.

[Guenterm (Win11, MAC OS, DPL 5, FP, VP, Nik4, Olympus)]

Hi Bryan,

that’s what I’ve said with my intro “Hi, thanks for all the testing information which still prevents…”

[Guenterm (Win11, MAC OS, DPL 5, FP, VP, Nik4, Olympus)]

@BHAYT

Sorry, you are correct but I don’t actually have all those details to hand

Hi again,

that is what I don’t understand…by looking to your system you will got all the informations.

Or did I understand something wrong?

But it doesn’t matter …I enjoy reading all the posts

[John-M (Melbourne, Australia - Win10)]

@JoPoV

Does backward compatibility works here ?

It does - sort of !

The setting for Saturation via Color Accentuation (in PLv6) does not equate exactly to the same % setting as it does for the conflation (ie. mixing & merging) of CA into HSL with PLv7 … but, when PL opens an image previously processed with PLv6 - it converts the PLv6 settings for Sat & Vib into “equivalent” settings for Sat & Vib on the global channel (the white one) for PLv7’s HSL tool.

BUT, the result is that global Sat & Vib settings (previously set via Color Accentuation) are no longer independent settings … and this mix-up has now been made even worse with PLv7.01 (now that resetting HSL settings ALSO resets global Sat & Vib settings) … Ahhhh !!!

[BHAYT (Bryan [WIN10, PL8, VP4, FP7, G9 & EM1 Mkii, RTX 3060])]

@Guenterm

that’s what I’ve said with my intro “Hi, thanks for all the testing information which still prevents…”

@Guenterm Thank you for the thank you I hope that the cheque is in the post sorry mail!

@Guenterm

that is what I don’t understand…by looking to your system you will got all the informations.

Or did I understand something wrong?

I can go looking I just find it tedious to have to dig all the details out of the system and out of whichever machine I am using!

@John-M then if you only want to clear the Colour channel settings do what @Joanna reminded me you can do or use the correct “crude” preset from the Partial Preset bunch I included in the earlier post and get DxO to change their mind, I’m holding my breath!

@John-M

The setting for Saturation via Color Accentuation (in PLv6) does not equate exactly to the same % setting as it does for the conflation (ie. mixing & merging) of CA into HSL with PLv7 … but, when PL opens an image previously processed with PLv6 - it converts the PLv6 settings for Sat & Vib into “equivalent” settings for Sat & Vib on the global channel (the white one) for PLv7’s HSL tool.

But what if both have been set on PL6?

[John-M (Melbourne, Australia - Win10)]

@BHAYT

@John-M then if you only want to clear the Colour channel settings do what @Joanna reminded me you can do

Because;

1. That requires that I separately double-click on each non-global channel “dot” to reset each one - one by one

AND

2. I’m not just thinking of myself - I’m thinking of the average Joe punter who doesn’t understand, when he/she clicks on the HSL reset button, that global Sat & Vib settings will be reset too !

@BHAYT

But what if both have been set on PL6?

Then resetting one of them (or disabling one of them) would not ALSO do the same for the other.

[JoPoV]

@John-M

The setting for Saturation via Color Accentuation (in PLv6) does not equate exactly to the same % setting as it does for the conflation (ie. mixing & merging) of CA into HSL with PLv7 … but, when PL opens an image previously processed with PLv6 - it converts the PLv6 settings for Sat & Vib into “equivalent” settings for Sat & Vib on the global channel (the white one) for PLv7’s HSL tool.

So when original v6.xx (or less than v6.xx) image have custom saturation settings applied both in HSL menu and in color accentuation, v7.xx “import” mixes those 2 values into 1 “a backward compatible way”_* , if I understand well.

Good.

_*_I mean image rendering does not change.

[BHAYT (Bryan [WIN10, PL8, VP4, FP7, G9 & EM1 Mkii, RTX 3060])]

@John-M

I’m not just thinking of myself - I’m thinking of the average Joe punter who doesn’t understand, when he/she clicks on the HSL reset button, that global Sat & Vib settings will be reset too !

@John-M agreed but the preset can be used in the interim by those prepared to use it and the rest are going to get a potentially unwelcome results.

@John-M

@BHAYT

But what if both have been set on PL6?

Then resetting one of them (or disabling one of them) would not ALSO do the same for the other.

@John-M Sorry I was referring to what “algorithm” is DxO going to apply if the user has used both the CA setting for Sat and the HSL “Master” channel setting for Sat? How likely that is in practice I don’t know!

@JoPoV has just responded with

@JoPoV

So when original v6.xx (or less than v6.xx) image have custom saturation settings applied both in HSL menu and in color accentuation, v7.xx “import” mixes those 2 values into 1 “a backward compatible way”, if I understand well.

Is that what we believe happens? I haven’t tested that scenario and am about to go out and start cleaning down gutters etc. ready for the changing season so it will have to wait until later.

[JoPoV]

@BHAYT

I haven’t tested that scenario and am about to go out and start cleaning down gutters etc. ready for the changing season so it will have to wait until later.

Don’t feel obliged. My question is just in case someone has already investigated this case.
I feel like I’m filling you in on a to-do list.

[John-M (Melbourne, Australia - Win10)]

@JoPoV

So when original v6.xx (or less than v6.xx) image have custom saturation settings applied both in HSL menu and in color accentuation, v7.xx “import” mixes those 2 values into 1 “a backward compatible way”_* , if I understand well.

Good.

_*_I mean image rendering does not change.

Yes - That’s how it works.

BUT, this approach is overly complicated - with all the confusions and implications that this thread explains.

I can see what DxO were aiming to do - but this was the wrong solution - IMO.

@John-M

I suspect an issue that DxO were aiming to deal with, via this change, is that there were (with PLv6) actually two separate global Saturation settings; one via Color Accentuation + another via the global channel in the HSL tool … which, no doubt, was complicating coding logic.

• All the same, it would have been a much better solution to have simply disabled the Saturation slider for the global channel in the HSL tool … and then Color Accentuation could have been retained;

• This would have been a “cleaner” change - without the consequences of PLv7’s implementation

[Wolfgang ([ Win10, PL+VP+FP, Nik7 / 3.3 ])]

@John-M

NOTE: This thread refers to the Global version of HSL … NOT the version available on the LA-Tab

John, now I only checked the global tool … but whatever I do (and with or without picker)
the counterclockwise arrow resets everything.

(PL7.0.1 Build 76)

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ok – just read that you had still been on RC3

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[hibri]

Hello DXO

Please bring a separate “Vibrancy and Saturation” Slider back, as in PL 6 under the White balance Tool as an option, maby with a posibility to hide it with a star-mark or something else.

The HSL Colour Wheel thing is to complicatet for 95% of all the fotos and is to slow for the standard workflow.

This is my wish for the next updat.

[Pat91]

Hi,

Thread after thread, year after year, when a forum topic is related to the Photolab UI, this seems to always drive to the same conclusion : lack of consistency.

I would say that we now have enough features, they just have to be enhanced/maintained/fixed. But we now really need an UI allowing to use them easily and correctly, along with a better (more detailed) documentation.

Time to do something about it.

[stuck (Canon, PL7+FP7+VP3 on Win 10 + GTX 1050ti)]

@Pat91

Time to do something about it.

Couldn’t agree more but that sort of work does not seem to be part of DxO’s ‘mission’.