Just an observation from a nobody/newcomer to the forum and DXO…
There sure seems to be a LOT of complaining and vitriol on here. Oh, and arguing over silly, silly things.
Tom
4 Likes
Tell me about it 
There are some who feel aggrieved with DxO because - well, just because. And, not taking into account that this is purely a user forum, on which DxO rarely intervenes they would rather annoy fellow users than take the logical route of filing a report to the appropriate email address at DxO support.
2 Likes
The devil is in the details. For many here with a lot of experience with the software and with photography in general even small details can be very important to them and are often the basis for argument. An issue with a feature that might be completely unimportant to you or me might be extremely important for someone else.
In addition, the whole PhotoLab suite is very expensive and at that price, anything less than perfection gets some people very upset.
After 7 years of being a member of this site, and owning every version of all three PhotoLab suite programs since PhotoLab 1, I’ve learned to manage my expectations. I rarely get upset or surprised by anything DxO implements , and I understand their general development strategy as well as anyone who is not an actual employee.
Mark
5 Likes
Also the DxO suite and PL specifically is different from many other raw developing applications.
For better or worse - but yet different and often requires an open mind to its prerequisites to be able to reap all benefits from it.
Because it delivers an amazing quality in regards to the work input.
If not one will easily get frustrated and annoyed.
Accept it. Embrace it. Enjoy it.
Within its realms.
1 Like
tell me which raw converter so very similar to another raw converter ( excluding obvious cases like rawtherapee clones/forks and such ) ?
SilkyPix similar to C1 or RPP similar to ACR/LR or Canon’s DPP similar to whatever Nikon has ?
1 Like
Nikons Studio is built by and upon SILKYPIX. It’s a SILKYPIX with custom code for all algorithms and specs supplied by Nikon with added u-point support (again).
Guess they licensed it back from DxO as they lost that when Google bought NIK.
Many developers are pixel based. They transform the Bayer matrix into pixels before they begin the editing. PL do not as it is parameter based and apply all adjustments before transformation to a pixel based image on export to a delivery format.
I have no experience from Canons or Sonys suites.
OK, so it is the the case of a clone … like rawtherapee and its forks/clones
you are grossly confused - all raw converters are parametric (“parameter based” in your language) … there are operations that some raw converters do before demosaick and some operations that they do after demosaick…
some do WB before demosaick ( like RPP ) some like photlab do it after …
some like photolab apply NR before/during demosaick ( and so does Adobe with AI based NR now ) …
if you want to understand why you are so confused about what photolab does after demosaick, I suggest you to export to DNG w/ only NR/optics correction applied and open it back again in photolab… that will tell you what PL / possibly / does before demosaick ( hint - just NR and optics corrections - everything else is done after “transformation to a pixel based image” )
As for “Many developers are pixel based” - all of them do demosaick (unless you have a raw with full “color” / quotes intended because before color transform those numbers are not even coordinates in any color space and then not all coordinates in some color spaces are actually colors that can be perceived by humans / data per sensel )
1 Like
I just sat here and read the posts (supposedly in response to my OP) in this thread… My point is made.
Tom
8 Likes
Indeed! Most forums that I belong to (for other interests too, not just photography) have a similar problem. Nonetheless forums like this remain a fantastic resource - I am new to PL and I have learned a lot from other users on here already. You just have to ignore the stuff that isn’t relevant or interesting to you.
Cheers!
3 Likes
@Joanna Few are aggrieved “just because”, their expectations may be based upon what they feel they should get for the money they spend on the product and its add-ons.
It wasn’t originally “just” a user forum as you well know and I believe that while DxO want to stay in the shadows they still have the occasional peek.
You a disrespecting forum users in the way I have seen DxO personnel also disrespecting forum users and it is unacceptable from you just as it is from them.
Yes I do post in the forum and some of my posts are critical of the product and DxO but they are accompanied by support requests as should all legitimate queries and complaints.
I will admit that writing about “Unwanted VCs” for the umpteenth time is boring for the readers and frustrating for the writer but could be fixed at a stroke if DxO actually prioritised some of the long standing issues.
Sorry @PopsInABox I just highjacked your post to make another complaint how unforgivable, except if I didn’t care about the product I wouldn’t bother!?
Sadly, until DxO either decide to fully moderate this forum or appoint some of the long term regular users of this forum as moderators, this will continue.
Sadly, I can’t see either of those things happening so things are just likely to get worse. I’ve been close to abandoning this forum on more than one occasion.
Maybe we should all, aggressively, flag any posts that are less than helpful? Perhaps DxO will take note when they get inundated with dozens of reports of flagged posts??
The open discussion here is left to the self-organization of the users - or so I assume too.
There is very little communication from DXO to the community, not even about important organizational changes. The link to the forum used to be called “feedback.dxo.com”, today it is called “forum.dxo.com”. If omen est nomen - then this has significant consequences, which must be constantly pointed out to newer forum members.
Feedback is labeled “the transmission of evaluative or corrective information about an action, event, or process to the original or controlling source”, forum “a medium … of open discussion or expression of ideas” (source Merriam-Webster). To my knowledge, however, this change has not been officially communicated.
In addition, communication with each other is often difficult because interests and professionalism are too far apart - just look at a parliament 
This also includes provocation, which can also be creative.
It would actually be the job of the six official DXO moderators to channel this.
Sounds like a great idea.
Tom
Hi,
Well, it seems that the message below received from DxO today puts an end to the debate about what the DxO Forum is :
Join our community forum!
Register and
-
- share your ideas*
-
- give us your opinion*
-
- get help*
Our teams are ready to listen!
Rejoignez le forum de notre communauté !
Inscrivez-vous et
- partagez vos idées*
- donnez-nous votre avis*
- obtenez de l’aide*
Nos équipes sont à votre écoute !
So, this forum is a user-to-user forum AND a feedback forum. This message clearly states that DxO reps are supposed to follow what’s going on in this forum. The form user feedback can take might be discussed, but as long as the terms used remain moderate (and are eventually moderated), everyone can intervene as they wish. Some may think that repeating complaints is annoying, but it’s sometimes effective (for example, after years of requesting a PDF version of each product’s current version documentation in PDF format, we’ve finally had satisfaction).
From now on, the traditional “this is a user-to-user forum, don’t expect… bla, bla” answer to a post can be considered as irrelevant. Please refrain. It’s now up to DxO to keep their promise (which doesn’t mean that they are supposed to directly answer each request in the forum).
3 Likes
And in fact they do. DxO opened a case and contacted me to get more details about one of my posts here, so I’ve send them the related RAW file for further study.
1 Like
For sure. Too much complaining, Some people seem to have a problem for every solution. And they like their problems because the fill in some emotional need for them, and if you try to take it away, they will defend it kicking and screaming. Seems to be a common thing to find such people on virtually all forums. Funny how that works.
2 Likes
The users who say this is a user forum with very little DxO input are speaking from years of experience where you very seldom hear from DxO. I think I have seen a comment from DxP once in very many months recently. I monitor these forums regularly. We can only hope that DxO do monitor these forums but there is very little feedback to indicate so.
From experience, if you want technical help with what you think is a bug or non-user issue then it is best to raise a case with support.
2 Likes
and raise it here, I would suggest.
Yes, that’s important because these are 2 different actions. Reporting a problem to the support may eventually trigger the opening of a new entry in the bug tracking system. However, because we’ll never see DxO calling users to collect further information about the reported problem, reporting the same problem here may allow to collect much more information (because of the multiple experiences and configurations). When the communication is limited to an exchange between a single user and the support, important facts might remain unnoticed.
And, by the way, as this is also a user-to-user forum, it’s an act of solidarity as well. Is this forum not here to share information ?
1 Like