Hi,
working with Lightroom and learned a lot by reading the books of Scott Kelby I have always loved the killertips. It was that simple in LR
Nice weekend to all
The light room print works I take it better than the PL one with erratic margins? Until the PL print module is revamped to work properly soft proofing for it is of little point as I for one can’t print as the margins are uneven. I use Affinity and its soft proofing where its printing doesn’t have the PL problems.
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I can’t say anything about that, because I have my prints made by the service provider. But I only want to do what is described in the video, and I get the profiles from the service provider.
And yes, I do it either in Affinty or in the old LR, which I still use as a DAM, which reminds me to set a reminder for December to catalogue all the summer pictures, including the reminder to order new wine 
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Not for RAW files, I believe?
The profile set in the camera’s settings is only used for generating JPEGs (and maybe the embedded JPEG preview).
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Certainly, Joanna - - I expect no less ! 
I think you’re making it sound much more difficult than it actually is. Not a lot has changed in-practice … just that one needs to understand when & why Soft Proofing is necessary … and (with the current PLv6 implementation) there’s a “gotcha” for those who don’t … I’m proposing to make it “fail safe”.
and …
Are you assuming you do not need to use SP if exporting to sRGB digital files ?
If so, you’re a candidate for being caught-out - - esp. images with saturated colours (See my example)
In which case, without my proposal, you’ll need to educate them on the need for Soft Proofing even when simply exporting to disk, and even for simply viewing the result on the same monitor.
Yes - I agree. I’m not arguing at all against SP. Most of us here will be fine with the new WCS - - 'cos we’ll understand why SP needs to be ON if we expect the exported result to always be the same as what we see within PL (when viewed on the same monitor).
However, PLv6 does NOT cater for those who do not grasp this. So, I’m posing a “fail safe” solution.
John
I’m not claiming to be an expert in colour management … but I was rather perplexed when I found that PLv6 could not be relied upon to always provide a WYSIWYG experience, as we enjoyed pre-PLv6.
- In fact, it’s this lack of consistency that will catch-out users … as they’ll assume all is fine - just like PLv5 and earlier - until it isn’t. Then it will be completely mystifying for many !
It took me quite a while to work out why this was so … which, to briefly summarise, is because PLv6 applies an additional Protect Saturated Colors algorithm “behind the scenes” - but, NOT if SP=OFF.
Note: Reference to using SP for printing is irrelevant for this discussion … other than that it exemplifies the reason why this “gotcha” will likely catch-out so many; 'cos it suggests there’s not a wide understanding that SP is also necessary for export to digital images (and surprisingly to me; including if subsequent display is intended only for the very same monitor).
Apologies for the long dissertation above … but, as we’re finding here in this discussion, it’s not an easy issue to explain.
John
Shouldn’t it be easiest to define a Display working space in the Settings, that will be applied when Soft-Proofing is off? Then at least you know what is going on. By default that can be set to srgb.
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before DPL6 you could choose the screen profile
now normally it’s like adobe LR:
photolab is supposed to automatically detect the screen profile (in windows) and therefore display the correct colors
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As a workaround - and we’re good at that with PhotoLab - we can
- Change presets to include WCS and Soft proofing
- Create a new colour palette
Note: use whatever settings fit your needs.
While I can agree to a certain level of automation and pampering, we also have to assume some responsibility in learning how to deal with new stuff.
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I have not yet exported from DPL6.
I have a screen covering 100% adobe RGB profiled with a probe.
I’ll do some testing to see.
if DPL6 works normally and the external viewer manages the screen profile well, you should not see any difference between DPL6 and the viewer
@Jhon-m:
are you sure that your problem does not come from an external viewer which does not take into account the screen profile?
this could explain (in part?) the differences
I made exports from DPL6 in adobe RGB
in the win viewer (configured to manage colors) in Lr (which automatically recognizes the screen profile and the image profile)
I have no difference in colorimetry between DPL6, the viewer or Lr.
DPL6 color management on win 11 seems to work for me
I just want to highlight another issue that I have requested: When Soft Proofiing is enabled the Compare button needs an option to compare with No Corrections (SP with geometry)
I know there is a workaround with virtual copies but that is really messy.
I believe this is a very necessary feature in PL6 and ties in with what @John-M had proposed.
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What about a preferences switch to make PL6 work like PL5 which would also enable you to select your display profile as before. After all, we have the option to use the Classic WCS so why not remove this option and just have the option to work like PL5?
I would be inclined to agree with you @Joanna. This would go hand in hand with my above proposal to make PL6 work like PL5 but still use the wide gamut WCS for additional flexibility.
Yes - and that’s how PL still works, Nicolas … That’s not the issue I’m alerting us to.
Yep - and that’s basically my workaround for now (except I’m using sRGB as my ICC Profile)
However, “Regular-Joe” user will not appreciate the need to do that; I’d prefer to see a “fail safe” solution that does not (as now) have the potential to catch-out unsuspecting users.
Yes, I am, Nicolas. This issue is different; See explanation above.
My apologies for the detailed wordage !! … I was trying to be as clear as possible.
I can only direct you back to my example above, Nicolas … Your tests are not detecting the issue at hand.
John
Yes - That would be another way of doing it …
Excellent suggestion … 
… Probably even better than mine (simpler) !
I will edit/update my proposed solution to suggest this alternative … Merci !
Could you elaborate a little, please Keith.
Perhaps (?) you’re suggesting;
- Re-introduce the PLv5 option to declare the ICC profile for the current display monitor;
- Then, if SP=OFF, use that setting as the fall-back ICC-Profile (to determine the parameters with which to apply the additional algorithm to Protect Saturated Colors)
That’s essentially a combination of @maderafunk and my suggestions … I like this too
Or, do you mean something a little different to (or more than) this ?
John
Thinking about this a bit more, here is what I would do:
- Make PL6 behave exactly like PL5 but using the new wide gamut WCS. This should not be difficult at all and there would be no confusion when upgrading to PL6 or for me users as you will retain the WYSIWYG functionality one has come to expect.
- When SP=On, then PL6 will behave as it does now with SP=On. The Compare button would also compare against the original image WITH the SP profile applied but no other corrections other than currently selectable options (with/without geometry).
How does that sound? I can’t see this being difficult to implement.
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I agree totally with your point 1.
My present PL5 workflow is:
- open image
- edit image
- for sharing to folks to look at on a screen, export to sRGB
- for printing, export to ProPhoto RGB
And that’s all I have to do.
So, if I want to do “the same” simple workflow with the new WGCS, what has to change? And why?
I have never used and don’t want to start using soft proofing. I find adjusting by eye on a calibrated screen has served me well for many years and I really don’t want to have to start doing it now.
I’m just curious: Is soft-proofing these days still necessary? My understanding of doing it was to have to deliver data for magazines printed on various print machines and various profiled papers on this machines, so it made sense to not do hard proofs but soft proofs. But whoever wants to print his/her images will almost certainly buy a decent printer at least in A3+ or bigger. There are profiles for paper and printers, monitors are calibrated (again, in the workplace of serious amateurs or professionals). I have to join the question of @Joanna: What has to change?
Edit: Just saw, there’s PL 6.0.1 which should solve some problems with Soft-Proofing.
6.01 only for Mac, not for Windows.