PL6 Tone Curve Implementation

Should have put a tongue-in-cheek emoticon on that comment. Not gone back yet, but each has its own challenges and each some fabulous features. I wonder if I asked ChatGPT to write me a piece of software that combined the best of each what it would do. There is a saying that a camel is a horse designed by a committee so maybe that is the sort of thing that would result!

to add some examples

Screen Shot 05-31-23 at 01.46 PM
taken from Nik SilverEfexPro 3

Screen Shot 05-31-23 at 01.49 PM
taken from FilmPack 6

Screen Shot 05-31-23 at 01.57 PM
the picker function – taken from LightRoom 5.7 !!

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Switching RAW developer is very uncomfortable. I was completely at home in Apple Aperture. Forays through Lightroom, Iridient Developer, CaptureOne never left me truly comfortable with the software as I was with Aperture (considering both ease of use and results). Of course, I did get good results but it was non-intuitive for me.

Once DxO removed the rootkit licensing system, I tried PhotoLab 1. I was home again.

My point is that it will be difficult to transition from expert C1 user to expert PhotoLab user. Even though I have a reasonable amount of experience on C1, I’d be very miserable if I had to give up PhotoLab at this point.


Practical Example: As I shoot a lot of high ISO, Prime and later DeepPrime has been very important for my work so beyond just preference, it would be very cumberson to obtain the same results in C1. Somehow I’d have to finish my photos full of noise and then run them through Topaz NR. How much noise to leave in the mezzanine masters would be a constant question, along with how to tweak Topaz NR per photo without turning it into half a day wasted on just NR.

Indeed. Resizible window. I would allow more precision when drawing curves and so more precise results (assuming used numbers use enough precision …).

I think this is C1’s biggest shortcoming: noise handling at medium/high iso.

No; too long to operate. And puts boundarys that may have to often be changed.
CTRL or ALT or SHIFT modifier (with possibility for user to enter both normal and modified speed ratio) is really faster to operate : instant acces to 2 slide speed possible - without releasing the mouse nor turning the focus away from the work area. Both user tweakable. No boundarys.

@uncoy I think that when a feature appears that has great significance to the way you work or the type of image you take then the decision becomes easier … very much, if it does that then I’ll manage with the rest. For me, C1’s strengths are very much PL6’s weaknesses (shortcuts, speed keys, limit on highlights and shadows adjustments effect) - and certainly vice-versa (noise reduction, camera/lens modules, cloning/healing with source manipulation, canvas distortion to ‘fill in the corners’, bundled pre-sets and a bucket-load more with the [I think] reasonably-priced Film Pack).

I would like to think I am an experienced C1 user. Over the last 20 months I have used v21 and v23 on both AMD and Intel laptops, with both Catalog and Session databases. Over that time, the database and it’s very many export siblings has developed corruption on over 50 occasions. Each time C1 has ‘repaired’ the corruption but they have been silent on the question as to whether my database might develop terminal corruption due to this issue and as a consequence, loose all my thousands of edits. I can’t rely on the backups as I have found some of the repaired backups are corrupt. C1 Customer Service (I use the term loosely) have not helped and the problem persists. They now tell me they are not going to devote any more resource to my problem (I did ask them ‘what resource’ but did not get a meaningful response). To be honest, I want to stay with C1 but the bad taste in my mouth and the huge chip on my shoulder are difficult to discard.

My only real problem with PL6 is in the basic editing. The shadows, blacks, highlights area operate so differently that I seem to have difficulty. Online tutorials don’t help - they tell me what the sliders do (and I know that) but its what they do to the image that I struggle with. I’ve studied the tuxdo (?) website and that is superb, but still difficult to translate to reality.

I’m sorry @kap55 I’ve rather hijacked your thread.

Clive

said it before…

DxO would really benefit from a study on the (very) old Kodak PhotoDesk software that supported the very first ‘real’ DSLRs. Very Good Stuff from a capabilities and from a workflow/ergonomics POV.

I have to agree, curves is a powerful editing tool and deserves fixing. For people comparing software it seems as unnecessary own goal to have such a poor implementation of such a powerful tool.

Recent ON1 changes to their curve tool include histogram, image “picker” adjustment tool, and helpful colour gradients on the colour channels, perhaps can provide improvement ideas.
ON1 Curve-1
ON1 Curve-2

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That would be excellent!

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I would say this is a MUST HAVE.
With ability to draw very precise curve added !
No doubt about it.

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Just wanted to add that DxO already has wonderful Level/Curve adjustments - but unfortunately they are only in Nik Color Efex. If they could just make the Tone Curve tool in PL6 (or PL7) the same as the Level/Curve tool in Nik then it would be a huge improvement to their program. Don’t think it would be too difficult to do.

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I think so far the best curves adjustment, control and implementation I’ve seen is in Davinci Resolve. Anyone who worked with it, will probably find it both powerful and intuitive with some unique features. Having something like that in DXO would be great. That being said. I think with all the sliders offered in DXO as it is today, its not critical or necessary to use curves anymore, but for those who prefer it and find current implementation inadequate, I vote for Davinci Resolve style curves.

Different Color Curves DaVinci Resolve 18 Tutorial

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You’re talking about a real interface here.
Would be nice. Indeed. But sounds far away from photolab …

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Yeah, probably a bit too ambitious, but if I was doing it, that is the route I would take. I worked as colorist with resolve, and even compare to Photoshop or pretty much all the photo editing apps, the video world, I guess because of bigger budgets are far ahead in color grading technology and refinement.

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I think they’d have to rethink the entire interface.
Now that adobe enter AI game, photolab needs to find a way to be more efficient.
Allow us grade precisely our images.
Allow us attach, detach, resize windows and compose worspace as needed.
Allow us to compare images and different applied settings easily.
And so on …
But yes, a lot to do … Probably out of budget.

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It seems they only focus on very small points when a global strategy is needed.

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Well I don’t think they can or really should compete with Adobe. Adobe is a giant that cares not of creatives or artists and wants everyone on subscription… that leaves room for companies like DXO to be what Adobe once was and cater to artists and not activists. To cater to main street not wall street.

Adobe seems to be now using their Firefly and generative AI as a Trojan horse, once they acquired and merged with every competitor and stock website they trained the AI models with user data as well, and now they will offer it to big companies (enterprise) for licensing fee and subscription. they have no interest in actual artists. I hope DXO and similar smaller companies see the operunity in that to be more humane and personal and less cooperative and don’t even try to play the game head to head with the likes of Adobe giants, since its a war they cannot win.

Adobe is Making its Firefly Generative AI Available to Big Businesses
Jun 08, 2023 via PetaPixels

Adobe has announced that it is making its Firefly generative artificial intelligence (AI) available to enterprise customers to allow brands to deploy it across their organizations and custom train it with their own assets.

“The new company-wide offering enables every employee across an organization, at any creative skill level, to use Firefly as a standalone service, as well as with Express and Creative Cloud applications to generate, edit and share standout, on brand content quickly and easily,” Adobe says.

Also woke death cult of degeneracy promoted by Adobe with their rainbow logo, feminist movie poster as a splash screen in Photoshop etc. Not good. As long as smaller companies don’t go the woke path they can attract the sane and normal people based on principle as well. As we have seen with Bud Light, Nike, Target etc all that ESG and DEI programs are backfiring. Building a brand is hard as it is, but these companies have pissed it away so quickly because they weer chasing profit and ideology.

“The road to business success is wherever people need another road.”
― Robert Brault

The market is driven by; Narratives and emotions in the short run, Fundamentals and truth in the long run. Use this to your advantage.

Business 101: You will be paid in direct proportion to the value you create in your chosen marketplace niche.

Branding started in Scandinavia in the middle ages. It was an action of burning a symbol on to the flesh of cattle in order to signify ownership of the animal. It was also a way to offer a guarantee or “promise” of quality and source. In other words; “If you buy cattle from us, we will deliver meat of exceptional quality. We always deliver on time and that’s a guarantee (promise).”

Branding represents ownership. But ownership is not valuable to the potential client, it is valuable to you. It is a way to protect yourself from others using your hard work. Unfortunately clients don’t hire you for protecting yourself. They hire you for something else. They hire you for the promise, that stands behind the authenticity of the source. Because they believe it represents certain standards of quality valuable to them.

A brand is ultimately an experience that lives at the intersection of promise and expectation.

A brand is a promise.
A good brand is a promise kept.
But a truly remarkable brand is the one that surpasses the expectations on consistent basis. Wow!!! Every time.

Branding is the message you put out in the world through the choices and actions within your control. While the reputation of the brand is how other people interpret your brand. When you make a promise, you can convince a person one time. When you deliver on the promise you can can convince them another time. But when you deliver more than expected, than they deliver for you. …they become brand ambassadors.

Brand expression (branding by advertising, what you say about yourself) vs. Brand Image (branding by reputation, what others say about you)

A brand is just a symbol. And a symbol on it’s own does not mean much without the proper reputation. The symbol is simply a way to avoid having to prove your credibility all over again. Because that would not be very economical. But reputation alone would not mean much, unless there was a way to identify it. And we do that by branding. We essentially brand our reputation.

Ultimately the brand advertises reputation, and the reputation is what ultimately sells your the brand.

Your reputation preceded you. It will open or close the doors of opportunity before you every reach them. It is one of your most valuable assets. Act accordingly.

“It takes 20 years to build a reputation and five minutes to ruin it. If you think about that, you’ll do things differently.”

  • Warren Buffett

If people are indifferent about your brand, they won’t care about your brand. If they don’t care about your brand, they won’t tell their friends. And if they don’t tell their friends, you will have to do it yourself. Convincing someone else’s friend, is much harder than convincing your own.

Don’t put your brand name on everything, it is the easiest way to weaken it’s influence. Because the more general it is, the less likely your potential clients will think it’s for them. Specialize in just several areas and master them.

“If you think having the lowest price in your industry is a good strategy, remember that someone is always willing to go broke faster than you.”
~ John Morgan, Brand Against the Machine: How to Build Your Brand, Cut Through the Marketing Noise, and Stand Out from the Competition

CLIENT AWARENESS is when potential clients know you exist and can correctly associate you with the services you are offering.

CLIENT PREFERENCE is when they prefer you over your competitors under the assumption that you can deliver the service you offer and that it can meet their needs at that particular time.

CLIENT LOYALTY is when clients want to do business with you for years. They insist on doing business with you no matter what and they will tell everyone how awesome you are.

A brand is a promise. A good brand is a promise kept. But a truly remarkable brand is the one that surpasses the expectations on consistent basis.

“You have a great name. He must kill your name before he kills you”
~ Juba, to Maximus in Ridley Scott’s Gladiator (2000)

There is a lot of room left behind for people who don’t want to be part of that and this is where companies that are smaller but sane, like DXO can benefit if you are smart.

cartoon2716

Also don’t do any suicidal stuff like do you remember when Adobe threaten to sue users for owning Adobe software, lol?

Adobe Creative Cloud subscribers who haven’t updated their apps in a while may want to check their inboxes. The software company has sent out emails to customers warning them of being “at risk of potential claims of infringement by third parties” if they continue using outdated versions of CC apps, including Photoshop and Lightroom. From a report:

These emails even list the old applications installed on the subscribers’ systems, and in some cases, they mention what the newest available versions are. In a response to a customer complaint on Twitter, the AdobeCare account said users can only download the two most recent variants of CC apps going forward.

A spokesperson said in a statement, “Adobe recently discontinued certain older versions of Creative Cloud applications. Customers using those versions have been notified that they are no longer licensed to use them and were provided guidance on how to upgrade to the latest authorized versions.” However, the spokesperson said Adobe can’t comment on claims of third-party infringement, as it concerns ongoing litigation.

Or this Pantone/Adobe insanity to piss of a lot of users.

I Have to Pirate COLOURS Now?? - Pantone Connect + Adobe split

I think there is opportunity for smaller companies to compete for users that were betrayed by the big soulless corporations and as there is a lot of value in relationship building that respects the users. Loyalty is profitable but requires human touch and integrity, and not excel spread sheets where lawyers and accountants are making decisions for the company and have nothing to do with what users wants or need.

Anyway, just my 2 cents [end rant]

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And I thought I am member of a photo forum :innocent: :rofl:

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It’s not thinking about compete with adobe. That’s not realistic.
But one of the 3 key feature which leads people to photolab is their Ai denoising.
(The others are their lens/camera analyse and they don’t hold users hostage).
Now adobe play this game, and obviously they will play it well.

So I think photolab needs to show more muscles for the future.

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