Did you listen to h s arguments???
George
Yes, but as I see it, he is talking about someone or something that moves around in the “picture frame”. in my case, I’m moving the camera around with the person or animal or object, so the camera is likely to see it as a “fixed” object within the image. If the animal or person or whatever moves closer to me, or further away, I want the camera to “track” the focus.
The 3-D tracking may or may not work for me.
I know that AF-S won’t work for me, as that is what I used.
I suspect AF-C is what I need, but that’s just a guess.
What is your reasoning? I’m just guessing here.
Added later - I understand a little bit of this, but it’s all very fuzzy in my mind. Perhaps tonight I can watch a collection of the YouTube videos, and read those articles again, studying what I’m reading. What I think I’ve learned, is if I want to capture a “static” picture, all I need is AF-S. Press the AF button on the back of the camera, it will focus on wherever I put the small black rectangle, and I’m done. With AF-C, as long as I hold in the back button, as I move the camera around, the camera will continue to focus. Regarding all the focusing points - I’ve long since forgotten how to work with them.
Lots of reading, and lots of testing stuff out, and/or I can get out the Leica and forget about all this stuff. With the Leica, it’s up to ME to get the focus right. No focus points, no AF-anything, no AF at all.
I should sign up for one of Joanna’s classes, and I suspect she’s going to tell me to ignore all this stuff and focus the way I used to… of course, that didn’t work out too well for me on my trip. I fully expected sharp images. Ain’t what I got! Oh well. If I’m smart, I’ll forget all about this until tomorrow, and edit one more image from my trip.
Absolutely.
That’s what I understand. As I said, I change the AF-C “following” mode to “Grp” because that seems to work best for what I have played with.
What is “Gap” and where do I find it?
I think all the “fancy” tools I’ve been writing about are already on your D850. You may enjoy watching the same videos I linked to, or better ones.
One last photo to post. I’ve got lots more that I like, but I don’t think of them as “complete photos”. For the photo I’m posting now, I liked it because I had a nicely organized view of the pond, one fancy palm tree, one of the “purple leaved” plants that I enjoy and it sort of “flows” - and lots of shades of green. Foreground is sharp, background is not. I hope the control line is acceptable. If I printed my images, I would certainly print this one.
I already edited it once, but it didn’t “work”. I deleted the .dop file, and started doing the editing again, this time being more careful to avoid a few things.
780_1356 | 2023-06-12.nef (31.9 MB)
780_1356 | 2023-06-12.nef.dop (16.8 KB)
…I remember there being a blue sky. Maybe not quite as blue as what I did here.
I think this is enough photos of my Fellsmere visit.
Tonight and tomorrow is studying about Auto-focus on the D780.
Next week I’ll start taking new photos again.
This has been very instructive!
Look to your own message and the word is Grp, not Gap.
Why? I practice what I preach and ignore all the “fancy” stuff.
Do you do anything to make it easier to photograph things that are moving, such as birds?
Maybe all I need to do is change from single-focus to continuous focus, nothing more.
Birds in flight is a whole other thing. I’m not sure it is one of @Joanna’s areas of interest. In any case dedicated birders change a number of settings to track and capture birds in flight, which usually also includes back button focus among various other settings. There are many videos available to set up Nikon cameras for BIF. I am not sure if you have an appropriate lens to capture BIF while retaining the fine detail.
Mark
2 Likes
Stick to AF-C , it’s the best of both worlds. Press it once and take your finger off then you emulate AF-S (you can reframe and your focal length will be locked where you pointed and pressed the button). Keep your finger on the button and the focus will reacquire as the subject you’re pointing at moves.
Try to find the path of least resistance with everything you do @mikemyers , you’re less likely to overthink and start flip flopping and it’ll stick
BiF shooting is an olympic sport, or it should be. 
Lots of those guys are using a FF, a chimney of a lens, and a tripod with a hanging system. (like a 50mm for the gunmen in a helicopter.)
Often they just wait in a spot they hope/know the birds are comming/turn up.
Kingfishers for instance the only way to have those inframe is wait wait wait get eaten by musceto’s, wait some more, wile watching the suspected favorite fishingspot of that kingfisher. (who could be fishing just behind the tree because he spotted you).
My kind of BOAK (birds of any kind) shooting is i just walk around and hope i have the right lens mounted when i see something interresting.
Aldoh if you want to practise, best place for doing that is on your coach through the window.
Setup a bird feeder spot, best to have the cat also inhouse 
, make the food irresistable and wait. (As certified BiF shooter your not allowed to use food to atract your bird of interrest in order to get the desired picture… But who cares as BOAK shooter. 
2 Likes
If I was serious about bird photography, which I’m not, I would buy a Nikon Z9, and an appropriate lens. I would install the latest firmware update for the Z9, which is quite amazing. What then becomes possible is now one of the hottest topics I found regarding the Z9. There are lots of videos about the new feature, but I found this video that showed me so much more:
This may be a better way to understand how this new feature works:
I think, as you have pointed out, the biggest change for me will be to try out AF-C and AF-A on my D780.
Based on previous decisions over the years, on the one hand, I’m surprised that I can resist ordering a Z9 (and all new lenses), but the types of photographs I most want to create have been taken with a D850. It’s not the camera, it’s the photographer - I know that - but I can put my D780 next to my re-acquired D3, I suspect the quality of my images would suffer.
The D3 is like finding an older piece of clothing, that I used to love. I pick it up, and other than for the size and weight, I’m very comfortable with it. Joanna would tell me to check the dynamic range, which tells me to leave the ISO at 200.
I do have a balcony, and I could put a bird feeder on the railing, and likely attract lots of birds, but from past experience, I wound have to deal with “bird droppings”.
I wish more of you were posting YOUR recent photos here. The more I post, the more feedback I get, and the more capable I get, but I find it fascinating when someone (usually Joanna) posts an image here, and then a description of HOW she was able to capture the image. I find that very educational, and unlike PhotoJoseph, I can ask questions, and eventually better understand.
Regarding the photo I posted last night, the sky did not look “real”. By changing the “Exposure” and “Contrast” settings in the control line, the photo now appears much more realistic to me.
780_1356 | 2023-06-12.nef.dop (17.3 KB)
Here in Miami, it’s a dull, gray, rainy, dreary morning, with thunderstorms throughout the day. I’m unlikely to go wandering around South Beach, looking for 1950’s style architecture. Probably a perfect day to stay home, and learn AF.
What I thought I knew was from ages ago, but it was irrelevant as I had no need for continuous focus on the D780 until this trip - I didn’t think much about it, but I thought my D780 was set up properly, but that was only true for my D750 and previous camera, my D3. But then, with the D3, I found I got better photos if I picked a spot where I wanted the race car to be, and as it approached that spot, I photographed it in “high speed burst mode”. This was fine with the small racing cars, but useless for the birds, who wandered, or swam, to random places.
To be honest, I doubt I will have any use for these settings until October, when I might visit my brother again.
As the websites say, setting the back button to AF-S is all I really need, but AF-C on a non-moving subject is the same as AF-S. I want to understand AF-A, which I never heard of before.
Yes, that is my plan as of now, along with finding what AF-A does and if it might be better.
FOR BIRD IN FLIGHT (ALONE, NOT GROUP), I would say as guideline (some details are for nikon cameras, as I know you shoot nikon) :
1 . Forget ! the rear screen, EVEN IF you’re using a tripod (way easier to track nicely in the viewfinder).
2 . Back button focus, AF-C mode, AFC priority selection : RELEASE (even if the cameara don’t think bird is in focus it could be and often is when your technique is good - bad to miss a rare shot you could get).
3 . Try to use as small focus “zone” you can manage (talking about dslr - hybrids are more complex to use - nikon side). It depends on you (your ability to track the subject) and on the conditions of the shot. So you have to experiment and progress on this.
I try to use only one focus point when conditions allow that. Group works well too under some circumstances but tends to focus on the nearest pat of the subject (not good to have the beak sharp and not the eyes when the bird comes to you).
3b . Focus on the EYE ! if the eye is tack sharp, image will look sharp ! It should be the sharpest part of your image.
4 . Use the lens with the larger aperture possible. Even if you lower it for the shot, AF will measure at full aperture, and AF system is more precise and fast when it get a lot of light.
Use if possible lens wich are sharp at largest aperture (long focal prosummer and prime lenses generally are at largest or near to largest aperture).
5 . Shoot fast BURST. AF is not constant, and you will find some images more sharp than other in your burst. You too will have choice for the better wing position of the bird (very hard to ask bird to put wings where you would like).
6 . Get a fast memory card to empty your camera buffer as fast as possible (bad to fill the buffer and then action become more interesting).
7 . Most important setting : SHUTTER SPEED.
Set it fast enough (better more than less if you don’t know) ! It depends on you (your ability to keep the bird at the same place in the frame), the size of the bird (little birds are faster and more erratic than big birds), the direction if the bird (bird come to you or bird crosses laterally) and the size the bird in the frame (but you want it as big as possible in the frame, isn’t it ?).
Shutter speed must freeze the bird motion, your hand motion and the vibrations due to the mirror.
A base to begin and then adjust more or less : 1/1600 big birds - 1/3200 small birds (and sometime more).
8 . Second important setting : APERTURE.
It depends on the shot you want to do (and the amount of avalaible light). From full aperture to aperture that encompass the full bird in focus area. Anyway NAIL the EYE ! (this is why one focus point is better when possible. To track the eye). Lot of very good bird shoot are done at full aperture (with good lenses of course).
9 . Least important setting : ISO.
Just try to don’t go higher your camera can give clean shoot with FPRIME.
Of course, try to get it as low as possible, but better have a sharp noisy but usable shot than a not sharp shot which will go to the trashcan. Fast enough shutterspeed is the more important setting.
10 . Put your VR selector on SPORT (important!). This will avoid VR to stabilize the direction you track - only the other directions, and avoid having the bird to move erraticaly in the frame the direction you track due to stabilization.
11 . I would recommand to use Manual or manual + auto ISO.
If light is not changing Manual is better, if light is changing, auto ISO will compensate.
Think about the color of your bird. White birds don’t need the same exposure as dark birds. I let this to you.
10 . Position yourself.
For smooth background, try to get at leats twice the distance between your subject and the background than between the camera and the subject.
Choose your background. With telephoto lens often moving yourself just a little change background drastically.
Being at eye level generally give more “interaction” between people looking at the picture and the bird (more important for portrait bird).
11 . Know your subject.
For example, birds generally take off against the direction of the wind.
12 . Take your shoot :
Frame and track the bird as soon as possible (even if it is far away), put your focus point on it, push backbutton to acquire focus, release and push again if you miss it (camera not aquire focus or background focus), then when the bird fills the frame enough shoot long or several small burts depending on what’s happening (All this can be very, very fast).
13 . Practise, practise, practise !
SOME TIPS HERE ARE FOR DSLR, HYBRIDS HANDLE AF DIFFERENTLY.
1 Like
I appreciate everything you wrote, but at the totally random times when I see a bird and want to photograph it, all I can do is the best I can, with whatever camera gear I have with me. I’ll plan ahead if I visit a zoo, or the Florida Everglades - or Colorado!
You reminded me of why I used to use “release” mode. Yesterday I selected “focus” mode. I will change it back.
When I’m able to do so, I know this is best, but most of the time I am just focusing “on the bird”.
If I get serious about this, that would be a good idea for me. I rarely take enough images to fill the buffer, but if I wanted to, a faster card would be good. I am now using a SanDisk 170 mb/s 128 gb card.
Just checking Amazon - there is a 64 GB 300 MB/s card available for $65, twice the cost of the cards I am now using. I’ll remember this for when/if I need it.
I guess my setting of 1/1000th wasn’t nearly high enough. Easy to correct next time.
This might be my plan, as I want a blurry background.
At first, I was going to use auto-ISO, but Joanna suggests I just set a reasonable ISO, and correct any exposure errors in PhotoLab. I will try both.
I found all your tips very helpful, especially the last one, Practice. I rarely get to do this, but I will try.
This mostly matter on cloudy days when clouds move a lot, or when you want the best lights which are very early when the sun rise. Here light is often changing faster than you can tweak setting on this kind of action shot.
For starters, I had no expectation of capturing birds in flight. They took off, and I continued to shoot, pressing the back button frequently. I’m amazed I got images as good as I did, even if they weren’t “up to standards” for “BIF”.
The images before I selected auto-iso ranged from too dark to good to too light, as the birds moved around. Once I selected auto-iso, all shots were closer to correct exposure.
I did sign up for BirdPhotographers.Net - I't Ain't Just Birds! - BirdPhotographers.Net but they haven’t approved me yet.